I currently have 300/50 5G SA capable line on Elisa here in Finland running on an RUTX50.
The device is locked to 5G SA N78 (thanks @Daumantas) using the RutOS UI and a custom script.
As I bought the line SIM only recently an Elisa rep called today about trying to sell an upgraded 5G line with an outside router. They wanted to sell me a Huawei 5G CPE MAX 5 with a contract, device placed inside/outside (own installation) for a 600/100 5G line (only their hardware offers 100 mbps upload he said) which the guy said would ensure a better connection as they would lock it some how to the closest 5G tower.
He said the Huawei 5G CPE MAX 5 would be configured for 5G NSA but could be switched to 5G SA. I had assumed these external use antennas would be configured for 5G SA.
Long story short he suggested that since current speeds for the 300/50 line seemed ok then the Huawei wasn’t necessary so I ordered the 600/50 (50 max upload speed when customer uses own router) as it gets higher priority on the nextwork. I had been thinking about doing this anyway so when the topic came up I decided to try it.
So the question, the rep mentioned this what I assume is a relatively new 5G tower in the area, or at least the closest one to me. On cellmapper which he told me to check, its “4501” and “Show Hex Values” sets it at 1195 - I don’t fully understand the difference.
I am not able to determine which 5G tower I am currently connected to and this “4501” can I in some way select that as a tower to lock to?
Hi @davyjones,
The number provided by the Elisa rep represents the tower ID of the carrier. It means basically nothing to the router. To determine if you’re connected to the correct cell (on this particular tower) you need to press on the cell in cellmapper and check it’s Cell Identifier. In your case, n78 band has ID of 73747886 - exactly the same as the cell you’re connected to:
Additionally, your signal parameters are very good for such a wide band, so I’m certain it’s the correct cell.
As for the speed test - could you clarify if this test was performed after switching to 600/50 plan? Could it be that it takes some time for the change to take effect?
Thanks @Daumantas sorry stupid me did not notice the even very obvious scrollbar so I did not see the additional info. And indeed it does appear to be the same tower.
Do you now what the addtional panels in the same column of info indicate, are they different nodes on the same cell tower or something since the physical cell IDs are not the same.
Each cell tower usually contains multiple physical cells. The most common cell arrangement is 3 cells, each covering 120° of area, and combining to cover the entire 360° around it. That’s what you see with band n28 in your cell tower as well - 3 different n28 cells, each pointing to a different direction.
As for why there is only one n78 cell - I’m not too sure. It could be a matter of network planning, or simply cost saving (or maybe the remaining n78 cells are not mapped?), but your carrier likely had a good reason to design it this way. If you were to lock onto n28 band on the router, it would likely connect to the n28 cell that is pointing towards your general direction. From what I’ve seen - cells on the same tower also share the PCI.
As for the remaining parameters - a lot of them are specific to the devices that mapped them on cellmapper, and the main useful parameters are PCI, ARFCN, band, and of course, cell identifier. They can help you “map” the cell to the parameters you can find in the Mobile status page on the router.
@Daumantas very, very useful info, many thanks! Actually I have had the device connect to N28 when I added it in Network > Mobile > Connection > 5G bands*. I added it there as cellmapper had shown it also being available and when connected to it over SA the speeds were not as good so I removed it.
I will try the N28 again later just to see if it’s the same tower. I guess it would be. And I will report the 600/50 speeds on e.g. N78 tomorrow as well. Is the RutOS System> Maintenance > Speed Test preferable since it’s native to the device?
It’s better to use a LAN device for speed testing, as when the speed test is ran on the router itself it consumes quite a bit of the router CPU resources, thus reducing the speed. But it’s worth trying both. Since your signal is very good, I don’t anticipate any issues.
@Daumantas The connection now seems to have switched to the 600/50 selected yesterday. The overall performance is not any better or at least from a first test of it.
I’m no expert here, the in the box antennas are 4db 4x4 MIMO correct? I was looking around at something more powerful that could be used maybe internally, such as this example 5db “Portable Antenna 4x4 MIMO 5G SMA” https://www.dustin.fi/product/5011352657/portable-antenna-4x4-mimo-5g-sma
or could you recommend something if would help to improve performance?
@davyjones for testing purposes, would it be possible to test the router by bringing it outdoors? I have a suspicion that this is not a signal issue, but it’s worth a try.
Also, could you try performing the same test on your phone? The phone likely has support for 5G CA, so I expect the speeds to be a bit higher, but I’m wondering if this could be an issue with congestion on this tower
@Daumantas thanks again for following up on this one
Okay so RUTX50 in open window.
Note I have MTU value also set on the WAN interface so I don’t know if that makes a difference or if using e.g. the speedtest desktop app might also show different data.
Then Elisa SIM from from RUTX50 in Samsung GALAXY A55 5G held in open window
No worries, I’m happy to help
It’s suprising to see such variations in the speed on the router. I presume the latest tests were done during evening when the load on the cell tower is much greater, and that could explain it.
As for MTU - 1500 should be fine unless you’re experiencing issues browsing the web.
Is the window you tested from oriented toward the cell tower?
Just for reference - could you try configuring 5G NSA and check the difference? Make sure to only leave n78 for 5G (no n28).
Hi @Daumantas yeps evening time. The new 600/50 was supposed to offer greater priority though…
And yes direct line of sight to the towers and the home is on higher ground. In red the 5G SA N78 tower (~300 m) and and in blue what I assume is the 4G LTE one (~500 m) but it’s not PCI 467, unless I have the wrong one. And the rest of the info is based on this 7760 5G NSA connection on LTE B3.
The I tried 5G NSA without the custom script, as I wasn’t rebooting and just used your LTE B42 and 3G B1 (since there’s no 3G) suggestion and the speedtest desktop x64 client, performance seems better than browser. I’ve never seen a 9 ms ping before so that was interesting.
Yeah, I’m currently on the 300/50 Elisa SIM with my RUTX50 as well, locked to N78 SA using RutOS and a bit of scripting (shoutout to Daumantas too!). So far it’s been solid.
Got a similar sales call from Elisa recently — they offered me the Huawei 5G CPE MAX 5 with that 600/100 line and mentioned something about “locking to the nearest tower” if I used their hardware. Sounded like they’d do some network-side config to prioritize the CPE connection, but only for their device. They did say it runs NSA by default but can be switched to SA — kinda surprised that it’s not SA out of the box.
Hi @zinaestel and a shout out to @Daumantas as well as always, there is no way I would have things setup as best as possible without their help
Interesting that you are also here in Finland and on Elisa, RUTX50 300/50 5G SA and especially as I don’t know anyone else here who has this device and is aware of and is using 5G SA.
Elisa sell the RUTX50 for small business internet and other devices from the range. They don’t seem to include external antennas, well of of course not, but it’s just interesting since for private consumer business they seem focused on Huawei/ZTE and having the router placed outside.
Bit of history if I may… I started with a DNA branded Huawei LTE router that I purchased from a Gigantti store (several years ago now) it had their branding in the admin software and while it had a “check for software updates weekly” option inside the UI it never received a single update.
Then I tried to upgrade to 5G on DNA - they sent a ZTE internal router and 2 x Sagemcom mesh devices, long story short I didn’t like the hardware, buggy software etc so I sent them back and kept the SIM. The I purchased the RUTX50 (2 years ago now) and have been using it since. Only then I learned there is 5G NSA and SA and waited for SIM only SA for almost 2 years until the start of 2025 since nobody would sell me a plan without their hardware as well and as far as I’m aware only Elisa here offer it at the moment.
I had have many calls with e.g. Elisa and DNA people where when I mentioned 5G SA they did not know what I was talking about. One guy in a DNA store one day thanked me for educating him
Where I live we can still get VDSL over phone line but I don’t know if it’s worth it, I think the download caps out at 100 mbps. ISPs won’t sell it to you unless you specifically ask for it, by default its always mobile they offer. There was a discussion about getting fiber in but most didn’t want it for various reasons cost, lack of ISP choice etc etc.
So I have the RUTX50 for home internet now.
A neighbour made a good point that how many people do we know with these external antennas installed, not so many. He thought maybe they are trying to get rid of them.
I came across a small YouTube channel recently where someone based in Finland was reviewing these external antennas and he mentioned that at MWC 2024 ZTE/Huawei announced a new range.
And yes good point that Elisa must be doing some network-side config for Huawei 5G CPE MAX 5 since I assume they are not customising the device itself other than adding specific settings since that would affect possible firwmare upates from the manufacturer. I mean they are I assume not customising the device firmware in some way.
And about my device settings - sorry for the small novel above
I am 300-500 meters from the node the Elisa rep said they would lock the Huawei external router to.
I went for the 600/50 line option, the 100 upload only if we use their device is nonsense but never mind.
The Elisa rep who called since I had purchased 5GSA 300/50 after a long discussion on the options when I noted I get not just 200 down but 300 said well then I don’t need the Huawei device. No mention of configuring my device on their network though.
When you say you’ve used “a bit of scripting” do you mean for example the following to lock the device to 5GSA only when it starts/reboots?
System > Maintenance > Custom Scripts
gsmctl -A 'AT+QNWPREFCFG= "mode_pref",NR5G'
exit 0
I had reset my RUTX50 to factory and did not apply the above yet and have only applied the settings I will show in the screenshots below.
And some connection test results for 5G NSA vs SA on auto vs manual
Tested on a Sunday morning - just to note for the “connection priority” thing when there should be more devices connected since 600 has higher priority than 300 and 1000 even more.
1. I set the MTU to 1500 on the SIM 1 WAN inteface and it’s at the top of the list. All other WAN interfaces not being used have been disabled.
A lot of useful information here, thank you!
Indeed the behavior seems strange. Having 5G SA on auto or manual band selection should make no difference. Were these tests ran back-to-back? Perhaps you could try downloading a larger file (>= 1GB) and check what speed the router maxes out at?
At least here in Lithuania, some operators have introduced some power-saving features on their end that limits the device speed until it is actually needed. That is, the speed “ramp up” time might be increased.
Finally, regarding the external antennas, I would recommend looking into QuWireless or Poynting offerings. Their antennas are high quality and should serve you for a long time. They are a bit pricier, but if this is your only internet source, it might be worth the investment. Just make sure that the antenna supports ~3500MHz frequency range, as that is what n78 uses.
Hi @Daumantas, very glad the info yesterday was useful, I’ve been trying to get the best out of weI have, since mobile is our only option right now and you have really helped a lot, I cannot stress that enough!!
Were these tests ran back-to-back?
Yeps on a Sunday morning around 11am local time. I noticed the speeds on early Sunday afternoon the previous weekend were slower than on the following Monday morning so I started to think about a higher speed line (for higher prority, which the ISPs don’t tell you about when you visit a store to sign up for a contract. Or at least in my experience they don’t) and then during that week an Elisa ISP called.
Perhaps you could try downloading a larger file (>= 1GB) and check what speed the router maxes out at?
Test data below with file ~1.2 GB is that big enough?
And when it comes to antennas I am to be honest not sure at all. I have been wondering, for a while now, and I only recently got access to 5G SA, do I need an external antenna. So when the Elisa rep called I was thinking about it.
Based on my distance from this 5G SA N78 tower of around ~300m would an external antenna help at all? If Elisa is saying only their Huawei devices support uploads of 100 and can be priortised (I assume some cell network configuration for the connecting device, and not something custom in an the actual OEM device) then would an external antenna help since I am still basically using non ISP hardware?
And yes investing in a proper antenna is advisable and indeed not cheap, of that I am aware. It would need to stand up to cold weather. Many of the options appear to act as an exclosure so the router is placed outside as well. I had assumed there would be some option of having the RUTX50 inside and an ethernet cable running outside to an antenna mounted on wall or roof and I assume it should be ‘omnidirectional’ so as to allow for network changes in the area. I am not sure at all so could you point me in the right direction for let’s say, RUTX50 inside, cable running out for antenna on a roof and omnidirection for N78 and whatever network configs might occur. 6G is coming as well etc etc
This is normal and is generally a very good indication that this is simply a limitation on either the carrier backhaul connection, or the cell site capabilities. From my personal experience, the speed dips are mostly noticable on evenings (when everyone comes back home), and the best speeds should be expected during very early morning hours. Not really much that can be done here. I don’t suspect that Elisa is hiding some higher priority plan expect for the one intended for emergency services.
As for the file download - I think the limitation is the download server. It’s quite hard to find a server that can max out 600Mbps connection, but I would suggest trying Google Drive or MS OneDrive.
Now regarding antennas - in your scenario I’d suggest using a directional antenna, since you know where the cell site is. Since we’ve established that at least some speed loss is likely caused by the limitations on the carrier side, it’s hard to say if an external antenna would benefit you greatly.
I personally am using QuPanel 5G antenna with TRB500 (same modem as RUTX50), and it has been great. But my device is quite far from the cell site, so that’s where the directional part of this antenna benefits greatly. For your case even an omnidirectional exterior antenna would likely be more then enough. But do keep in mind, that if you’re using RUTX50 WiFi the performance indoors will likely be worse if you go with the combo 5G+WiFi antenna.
Lastly, regarding the Huawei device, I have some doubts on whether it really is being prioritized, as it seems like you’re also consistently hitting over 50Mbps. I’m guessing it’s just what Elisa prefers for the customers to use, since they can likely manage that device remotely and troubleshoot any issues that the customers face, whereas on 3rd party hardware it’s up to the client to diagnose the issues.
Ok, thanks for the antenna tips! The QuPanel all seem 7dBi directional so I assume that’s what you have, and from the RUTX50 I assume MIMO 4x4 is preferable?
And the four cables with SMA connectors would need to be run inside the house and replace all 4 stock antennas I guess.
And no I would not look at one that included WiFi. And sorry what would the purpose of WiFi on the external antenna be other than to login to control it if it had such a feature? The Huawei antennas seem of include WiFi for that. Although they are a full on router as well of course.
And in terms of directional vs omnidirectional we live on the side of the lake where 4501 is and where most of cells are on the other side of the lake. I guess that’s not a factor as such, I mean if an directional antenna was installed on the side of the building where 4501 is I assume that’s okay for the long term, it being closest anyway.
